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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2015 23:22:40 GMT
One encounters a fair few people in Edinburgh who have voted for four different parties within the past few years, but I might suggest that that's not particularly surprising.
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Post by brothersideways on Apr 1, 2015 23:29:26 GMT
There's the fabulous Christina Summers in Brighton: elected as a Green councillor, she has since become an independent Christian extremist. Her twitter bio says, she's a Christian councillor in the most Godless city in the UK. We're lucky God sent someone to bring light to us heathens
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carlton43
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 1, 2015 23:32:27 GMT
There's the fabulous Christina Summers in Brighton: elected as a Green councillor, she has since become an independent Christian extremist. Her twitter bio says, she's a Christian councillor in the most Godless city in the UK. We're lucky God sent someone to bring light to us heathens Quite so. I would like to think Pagan is a far more English and Green description. I would hope many of you are fellow Animists. |
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carlton43
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 1, 2015 23:36:02 GMT
One encounters a fair few people in Edinburgh who have voted for four different parties within the past few years, but I might suggest that that's not particularly surprising. I thought it might be amongst us on this site in successive GEs? In locals people do move about a bit on personalities. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2015 23:41:29 GMT
Yes, Dawud Islam was the Green candidate in the Bradford West by-election, defected to Respect soon after the result and stood for them in Clayton & Fairweather Green in the local elections, only just over a month later. He got 481 votes in the by-election and 762 in the local elections. Assuming it's not somebody with the same name - it looks like he's standing for TUSC in Rochdale this time - although the crossing of the Pennines is probably a bigger switch than Respect to TUSC. I know I mentioned this on the defections thread recently, but I think it bears repeating that Dawud Islam is now in the Liberal Democrats. He was also a Labour councillor about 20 years ago. |
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Post by greenchristian on Apr 2, 2015 5:47:33 GMT
There's the fabulous Christina Summers in Brighton: elected as a Green councillor, she has since become an independent Christian extremist. Her twitter bio says, she's a Christian councillor in the most Godless city in the UK. We're lucky God sent someone to bring light to us heathens I'm not sure she counts (now or previously) as a "Christian extremist". When she joined the Green Party, she was of the opinion that we were the party most in line with Christianity on the vast majority of issues (abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage being the major exceptions). I'm not aware that her political opinions have changed that much since then, despite the break between her and the party. |
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maxque
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Post by maxque on Apr 2, 2015 7:11:47 GMT
There's the fabulous Christina Summers in Brighton: elected as a Green councillor, she has since become an independent Christian extremist. Her twitter bio says, she's a Christian councillor in the most Godless city in the UK. We're lucky God sent someone to bring light to us heathens I'm not sure she counts (now or previously) as a "Christian extremist". When she joined the Green Party, she was of the opinion that we were the party most in line with Christianity on the vast majority of issues (abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage being the major exceptions). I'm not aware that her political opinions have changed that much since then, despite the break between her and the party. Well, she is claiming she was expelled from the party for being a Christian, why she was expelled for voting against a motion of support to the government over legalizing gay marriage. She was expelled because she is an homophobe. Her twitter is all about her complaining about poor Christian bakeries persecuted by the gay community. |
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Post by Devil Wincarnate on Apr 2, 2015 7:29:11 GMT
Am I missing something? Are there actually Christian, homophobic bakeries? * Or is this woman some kind of lunatic?
* outside Norn Iron and the Western Isles.
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Post by brothersideways on Apr 2, 2015 7:58:05 GMT
There's the fabulous Christina Summers in Brighton: elected as a Green councillor, she has since become an independent Christian extremist. Her twitter bio says, she's a Christian councillor in the most Godless city in the UK. We're lucky God sent someone to bring light to us heathens I'm not sure she counts (now or previously) as a "Christian extremist". When she joined the Green Party, she was of the opinion that we were the party most in line with Christianity on the vast majority of issues (abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage being the major exceptions). I'm not aware that her political opinions have changed that much since then, despite the break between her and the party. She's taken part in anti-abortion rallies, including at least one outside of a clinic. Bringing threatening politics to people in a fragile state sounds extreme to me. Her views haven't changed, I don't think. But there's a massive gapbetween what she was elected as and what she is. Her ward contains two universities, including Sussex. I doubt she was voted in because of her personal objections to gay marriage, or for her support for the anti-abortion protesters who regularly come to campus. They're... not very popular. |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Apr 2, 2015 9:01:44 GMT
Am I missing something? Are there actually Christian, homophobic bakeries? * Or is this woman some kind of lunatic? * outside Norn Iron and the Western Isles. To be fair to the baker, I don't think he hates gays. He kept his feelings to himself, he just declined an order that went against his belief. Be 'fair' Stuart? be FAIR ?! This is modern Britain don't you know - there's no place for fairness in the wonderfully tolerant, diverse and vibrant modern Britain. No place for beliefs either unless they are the approved ones. A private business owner may not decide how to run his own business. If he doesn't conform to the orthodoxy of modern Britain he must be hounded out and denied his livelihood. |
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Apr 2, 2015 11:14:26 GMT
Obviously they are a sensible bunch.
If I run a bakery, and don't want to sell my stuff to gays, blacks, Jews, Green Party members, cripples, transgender folk or any other group, that's my damn business. And if I go bust, it's my own fault.
Also, why is it always bakeries and not hardware stores, for example?
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Post by finsobruce on Apr 2, 2015 11:31:15 GMT
Obviously they are a sensible bunch. If I run a bakery, and don't want to sell my stuff to gays, blacks, Jews, Green Party members, cripples, transgender folk or any other group, that's my damn business. And if I go bust, it's my own fault. Also, why is it always bakeries and not hardware stores, for example? This one could run and run I suspect but I would have thought it was fairly self defeating to go into business while resolving not to do business with large sections of the community. as to the second bit, the issue seems to be personalisation. There isn't usually any kind of discussion when you go into a bakery to buy things, but if you are offering to add messages/figures etc there is room for disagreement and problems. I'm not sure if there has ever been a libellous cake case but I'm sure one will come along at some point.. |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Apr 2, 2015 11:58:06 GMT
I was in Northern Ireland last week and the local papers had front page articles about a poll that showed that over 70% of people across all religious groups and demographics supported the bakery! Doesn't surprise me, most will be supporting him on the issue of the right to say what you want. This is Northern Ireland we're talking about, so it's not terribly likely that most people are guided by freedom of speech concerns. |
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carlton43
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Post by carlton43 on Apr 2, 2015 12:03:44 GMT
Doesn't surprise me, most will be supporting him on the issue of the right to say what you want. This is Northern Ireland we're talking about, so it's not terribly likely that most people are guided by freedom of speech concerns. Ah Yes. Another snide dig, this time on people from NI who mainly are unconcerned by any thoughts of free speech. How very YOU. |
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slon
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Post by slon on Apr 2, 2015 12:40:21 GMT
Am I missing something? Are there actually Christian, homophobic bakeries? * Or is this woman some kind of lunatic? * outside Norn Iron and the Western Isles. I was in Northern Ireland last week and the local papers had front page articles about a poll that showed that over 70% of people across all religious groups and demographics supported the bakery! Was this a bit like one of the Daily Express polls (99% say Muslims should be expelled from the UK, etc). btw..... there are reasons why making a public statement of refusing to serve someone because of their religion/race/sex etc is not regarded as a good thing, remember notices in the good old day of free speech in the 50s and 60s "no blacks", "no dogs or Irish" |
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Tony Otim
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Post by Tony Otim on Apr 2, 2015 13:37:15 GMT
Was this a bit like one of the Daily Express polls (99% say Muslims should be expelled from the UK, etc). btw..... there are reasons why making a public statement of refusing to serve someone because of their religion/race/sex etc is not regarded as a good thing, remember notices in the good old day of free speech in the 50s and 60s "no blacks", "no dogs or Irish" It was a proper polling company - ComRes I think? Some people may argue that that's self-contradictory... |
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Post by greenchristian on Apr 2, 2015 15:23:52 GMT
I'm not sure she counts (now or previously) as a "Christian extremist". When she joined the Green Party, she was of the opinion that we were the party most in line with Christianity on the vast majority of issues (abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage being the major exceptions). I'm not aware that her political opinions have changed that much since then, despite the break between her and the party. Well, she is claiming she was expelled from the party for being a Christian, why she was expelled for voting against a motion of support to the government over legalizing gay marriage. She was expelled because she is an homophobe. Her stance on same-sex marriage was that she supported giving same-sex couple equal rights under the law, but thought that those relationships were not the same thing as marriage, and wanted to preserve the then-current status quo where those equal rights were given under a different name. She thought that stance could be considered equal rights. The LGBTIQ faction of Brighton & Hove Green Party didn't. And her expulsion from the Green group on the council followed a history of tension between her and other councillors and party members (most notably her involvement in the insensitive pro-life demonstrations brothersideways has mentioned). Are we talking about the Northern Irish bakery that refused to decorate a cake to say "support gay marriage", and are being prosecuted for discrimination on the grounds of sexual orientation (despite this happening in a province where same-sex marriage is not currently legal, and them not asking about the customer's sexuality)? |
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Post by Davıd Boothroyd on Apr 2, 2015 15:42:07 GMT
Northern Ireland does have a law against discrimination on grounds of sexual orientation in the provision of services (the Equality Act (Sexual Orientation) Regulations (NI) 2006). It is argued by the Equality Commission that when Ashers' Bakery refused to bake a cake with a slogan supporting same sex marriage, they were indirectly discriminating against LGBT people, because LGBT people would plainly be more likely to order such a cake.
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Merseymike
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Post by Merseymike on Apr 2, 2015 16:06:41 GMT
To be fair to the baker, I don't think he hates gays. He kept his feelings to himself, he just declined an order that went against his belief. Be 'fair' Stuart? be FAIR ?! This is modern Britain don't you know - there's no place for fairness in the wonderfully tolerant, diverse and vibrant modern Britain. No place for beliefs either unless they are the approved ones. A private business owner may not decide how to run his own business. If he doesn't conform to the orthodoxy of modern Britain he must be hounded out and denied his livelihood. Tough. If his livelihood includes discrimination in the provision of the service then he should go and get a 'livelihood ' which doesn't include providing a service to the public. |
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neilm
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Post by neilm on Apr 2, 2015 16:11:43 GMT
Or maybe they should go somewhere else?
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