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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Jan 11, 2021 19:57:46 GMT
I had been really struggled round Romford, but clicked in the wrong place and accidentally seized on this solution:  Romford 76515 Upminster 70050 Hornchurch & Dagenham East 71511 Barking & Dagenham West 76589 Ilford South 75517 Ilford North 74684 Chingford & Woodford Green 75677 Walthamstow 70867 - unchanged Leyton & Wanstead 71330 The double-crossing of the Havering-B&D border isn't ideal, but then again neither is the double-crossing of the Redbridge-WF one and that's survived a couple of reviews so far and it isn't really any worse than that. I'm less keen on Ilford South's orphan ward, but that does seem unavoidable if Newham isn't grabbing one. |
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Post by kevinlarkin on Jan 11, 2021 20:29:33 GMT
First attempt at South London. Requires improvement.  1 Old Bexley & Sidcup 74317 Yes 2 Bexleyheath & Crayford 69948 Yes 3 Erith & Thamesmead 76728 Yes 4 Greenwich & Woolwich 69824 Yes 5 Eltham & Lee 74778 Yes 6 Lewisham North 70578 Yes 7 Lewisham South 75622 Yes 8 Dulwich & Peckham 71720 Yes 9 Camberwell & Walworth 74903 Yes 10 Bermondsey & Deptford 74417 Yes 11 Vauxhall and Borough 73988 Yes 12 Bromley & Chislehurst 72997 Yes 13 Beckenham 72978 Yes 14 Penge & Norwood 71615 Yes 15 Orpington 70474 Yes 16 Brixton & West Norwood 74773 Yes 17 Croydon South 71527 Yes 18 Croydon East 70201 Yes 19 Streatham 71449 Yes 20 Croydon West 71183 Yes 21 Battersea 71952 Yes 22 Putney 73038 Yes 23 Tooting 76986 Yes Two split wards: Fairfield in Wandsworth and Waddon in Croydon. |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Jan 11, 2021 20:51:39 GMT
Try as I might, I haven't been able to get five reasonable seats out of Haringey and Enfield, because the ward sizes in the former are just aggressively unhelpful for creating small seats. However, if you add Hackney into the mix then 7 large seats aren't too difficult:  Hackney Shoreditch 75007 Hackney Stoke Newington 76370 Tottenham South & Stamford Hill 71464 Hornsey 76100 Edmonton & Tottenham North 76859 Enfield Southgate 76929 Enfield North 76748 The trisection of Wood Green and the double-crossing of the borough boundary are, unfortunately, necessary to make the numbers work. |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 11, 2021 20:58:09 GMT
I've managed a full plan with 75 Yeses - it leaves a lot to be desired in places but it's something to work with (it helped that I'd basically done North London before Boundary Assistant was updated
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 11, 2021 21:01:36 GMT
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 11, 2021 21:13:14 GMT
First attempt at South London. Requires improvement. Two split wards: Fairfield in Wandsworth and Waddon in Croydon. You cheated  |
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johnloony
Conservative
Posts: 24,720
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Post by johnloony on Jan 11, 2021 22:50:09 GMT
First attempt at South London. Requires improvement. 1 Old Bexley & Sidcup 74317 Yes 2 Bexleyheath & Crayford 69948 Yes 3 Erith & Thamesmead 76728 Yes 4 Greenwich & Woolwich 69824 Yes 5 Eltham & Lee 74778 Yes 6 Lewisham North 70578 Yes 7 Lewisham South 75622 Yes 8 Dulwich & Peckham 71720 Yes 9 Camberwell & Walworth 74903 Yes 10 Bermondsey & Deptford 74417 Yes 11 Vauxhall and Borough 73988 Yes 12 Bromley & Chislehurst 72997 Yes 13 Beckenham 72978 Yes 14 Penge & Norwood 71615 Yes 15 Orpington 70474 Yes 16 Brixton & West Norwood 74773 Yes 17 Croydon South 71527 Yes 18 Croydon East 70201 Yes 19 Streatham 71449 Yes 20 Croydon West 71183 Yes 21 Battersea 71952 Yes 22 Putney 73038 Yes 23 Tooting 76986 Yes Two split wards: Fairfield in Wandsworth and Waddon in Croydon. Obviously the BCE won't want to split wards anyway, but in any case your proposed split of Waddon ward doesn't align with polling district boundaries. Your Croydon South would still fit within the permitted range without any part of Waddon. |
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Post by greenhert on Jan 11, 2021 23:24:18 GMT
Thankfully the rise in electoral registrations in the Deptford area around Goldsmiths University means Lewisham and Greenwich can be paired together with no ward splits at this time:
1. Deptford & Greenwich (76,155). Succeeds Lewisham Deptford. Contains the Lewisham wards of Brockley, Deptford, Evelyn, New Cross Gate, and Telegraph Hill, and the Greenwich wards of Greenwich Peninsula and Greenwich West.
2. Lewisham East (71,456). Contains the Lewisham wards of Bellingham, Blackheath, Catford South, Downham, Grove Park, Hither Green, and Lee Green.
3. Lewisham West (70,899). Succeeds Lewisham West & Penge. Contains the Lewisham wards of Crofton Park, Forest Hill, Ladywell, Lewisham Central, Perry Vale, Rushey Green, and Sydenham.
4. Eltham (73,604). Gains Blackheath Westcombe ward.
5. Woolwich (72,478). Succeeds Greenwich & Woolwich. Loses both Greenwich wards and Blackheath Westcombe, gains Abbey Wood, Plumstead, and Thamesmead Moorings wards.
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ilerda
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Post by ilerda on Jan 11, 2021 23:35:11 GMT
 I was just messing around with bits of London to see how the number stack up and accidentally made something that sort of works. Ideally all of Wood Green would be in with Hornsey but it's just a few hundred off in Tottenham that way. It's not dreadful this way though, and I think putting Fortis Green in with Finchley isn't too much of a problem either. The only issue is trying to find names for these seats that would satisfy people. 1 Enfield North 76824 Yes 2 Enfield South and Edmonton 74168 Yes 3 Southgate and East Barnet 70037 Yes 4 Tottenham 77061 Yes 5 Hornsey 75618 Yes 6 East Finchley and Golders Green 72846 Yes 7 Chipping Barnet and North Finchley 76987 Yes 8 Edgware 70986 Yes |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 12, 2021 0:11:21 GMT
Thankfully the rise in electoral registrations in the Deptford area around Goldsmiths University means Lewisham and Greenwich can be paired together with no ward splits at this time: 1. Deptford & Greenwich (76,155). Succeeds Lewisham Deptford. Contains the Lewisham wards of Brockley, Deptford, Evelyn, New Cross Gate, and Telegraph Hill, and the Greenwich wards of Greenwich Peninsula and Greenwich West. 2. Lewisham East (71,456). Contains the Lewisham wards of Bellingham, Blackheath, Catford South, Downham, Grove Park, Hither Green, and Lee Green. 3. Lewisham West (70,899). Succeeds Lewisham West & Penge. Contains the Lewisham wards of Crofton Park, Forest Hill, Ladywell, Lewisham Central, Perry Vale, Rushey Green, and Sydenham. 4. Eltham (73,604). Gains Blackheath Westcombe ward. 5. Woolwich (72,478). Succeeds Greenwich & Woolwich. Loses both Greenwich wards and Blackheath Westcombe, gains Abbey Wood, Plumstead, and Thamesmead Moorings wards. These are good but I think its dangerous to take an area like this in isolation without considering neighbouring boroughs, especially when as in this case some of those are out on the edge of the city themselves. It does make for some slightly awkward boundaries in Bexley and Bromley but actually no worse (and possibly better) than what I posted before. Starting from here I've created a far more coherent plan for South London than I had before. I guess this is because I started in North London before and got left with trying to fit everything in at the end in South London. The average seat size here is 73,968 which is very close to the London quota of 74,006 so getting the rest to fit shouldn't be difficult (but is somewhat on the current wards - I'm hopeful the new ones will give us a bit more leeway  1 Deptford & Greenwich 76155 Yes 2 Lewisham East 71456 Yes 3 Lewisham West 70899 Yes 4 Eltham 73604 Yes 5 Woolwich 72478 Yes 6 Erith & Crayford 74032 Yes 7 Bexleyheath 70311 Yes 8 Sidcup Orpington East 73803 Yes 9 Bromley & Chislehurst 74494 Yes 10 Crystal Palace 77058 Yes 11 Orpington West 71583 Yes 12 Croydon South 74718 Yes 13 Croydon East 74250 Yes 14 Croydon West 73323 Yes 15 Carshalton & Wallington 72545 Yes 16 Sutton & Cheam 71494 Yes 17 Bermondsey 74461 Yes 18 Peckham 76147 Yes 19 Streatham 71112 Yes 20 Dulwich & West Norwood 75314 Yes 21 Vauxhall 75439 Yes 22 Clapham 75211 Yes 23 Battersea 70027 Yes 24 Tooting 76986 Yes 25 Putney & Barnes 75515 Yes 26 Mitcham 76991 Yes 27 Wimbledon & New Malden 74527 Yes 28 Kingston & Surbiton 75410 Yes 29 Richmond Park 75737 Yes |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 12, 2021 8:13:35 GMT
So by nicking greenhert 's plans in Lewisham/Greenwich and East Anglian Lefty 's in East London, I've come up with a much better plan in Middlesex (but will be likely subject to change (hopefully improvement) with new ward boundaries)  30 Hampton 75947 Yes 31 Feltham & Isleworth 75168 Yes 32 Brentford, Chiswick & Acton South 71902 Yes 33 Southall & Heston 70932 Yes 34 Ealing South 72300 Yes 35 Hayes & Harlington 72896 Yes 36 Uxbridge & South Ruislip 75533 Yes 37 Ruislip, Northwood & Pinner 75938 Yes 38 Hammersmith & Acton North 72552 Yes 39 Fulham 72901 Yes 40 Kensington & Chelsea 74946 Yes 41 Cities Of London & Westminster 74457 Yes 42 Queens Park 75780 Yes 43 Harrow West 71559 Yes 44 Harrow East 72978 Yes 45 Hendon 70986 Yes 46 Ealing North & Wembley 74688 Yes 47 Kingsbury & Sudbury 74366 Yes 48 Willesden 75663 Yes 49 Finchley & Golders Green 75594 Yes 50 Chipping Barnet 74445 Yes 51 Southgate 73079 Yes 52 Enfield North 76824 Yes 53 Edmonton 76332 Yes 54 Tottenham 73703 Yes 55 Hornsey & Wood Green 76435 Yes 56 Hampstead & Highgate 75324 Yes 57 Holborn & St Pancras 70778 Yes 58 Islington South & Finsbury 76834 Yes 59 Islington North 75130 Yes 60 Hackney South & Shoreditch 73108 Yes 61 Hackney North & Stoke Newington 75401 Yes 62 Bethnal Green & Stepney 77000 Yes 63 Poplar & Limehouse 75814 Yes 64 Stratford & Bow 73574 Yes 65 Canning Town 70865 Yes 66 East Ham 70902 Yes |
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Post by 🏴☠️ Neath West 🏴☠️ on Jan 12, 2021 11:22:23 GMT
Camden realistically has to be paired with Barnet, since there is no combination of wards in Camden that will bisect it into two allowable constituencies. I'd believed this, but it is in fact wrong. The solution isn't even bad, ugly, or counterintuitive:  1 Hampstead 69849 Yes 2 Holborn and St Pancras 70449 Yes |
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Post by minionofmidas on Jan 12, 2021 12:21:57 GMT
Damn, and I was going to suggest pairing Camden with the city. Oh well, maybe Islington? |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Jan 12, 2021 12:48:57 GMT
Islington South & The City is rather nice, but it means you can't get 3 seats out of RBKC and Westminster, whereas if you give them the city and tolerate a few scraggly boundaries then they can stand on their own. I suspect Islington South will get De Beauvoir instead.
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Post by timrollpickering on Jan 12, 2021 13:20:28 GMT
The East end is as I posted previously, though I'm interested in options that keep the orphan Barking ward out of Newham Newham is generally a distinctly unhelpful borough for crossing the boundary with the Lea, Thames, the end of the Roding, North Circular and Wanstead Flats all being pretty strong natural boundaries that are problems to cross and past cross borough seats based around the A13 or the Woolwich Ferry have not been the best. However in the north west of the borough the boundary between Forest Gate & Maryland with Cann Hall & Cathall is pretty arbitrary running through streets to the point that the main sign of crossing the boundary is the change in the bins. And the existing Leyton & Wanstead seat has never been the most popular combination that has survived more on numbers than anything else. So if this doesn't create too great a ripple effect how would adding a Waltham Forest ward work? |
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Post by Pete Whitehead on Jan 12, 2021 13:30:05 GMT
The East end is as I posted previously, though I'm interested in options that keep the orphan Barking ward out of Newham Newham is generally a distinctly unhelpful borough for crossing the boundary with the Lea, Thames, the end of the Roding, North Circular and Wanstead Flats all being pretty strong natural boundaries that are problems to cross and past cross borough seats based around the A13 or the Woolwich Ferry have not been the best. However in the north west of the borough the boundary between Forest Gate & Maryland with Cann Hall & Cathall is pretty arbitrary running through streets to the point that the main sign of crossing the boundary is the change in the bins. And the existing Leyton & Wanstead seat has never been the most popular combination that has survived more on numbers than anything else. So if this doesn't create too great a ripple effect how would adding a Waltham Forest ward work? Not well - I tried with Cann Hall and the numbers were bad but in any case you still have to cross the Lea somewhere (and in that case you still have to do so between Newham & Tower Hamlets). If you wanted to avoid the Lea crossing there you'd have to bring in most of Leyton (4 wards) to go with the Forest Gate, Stratford and West Ham wards (thus leaving two whole seats in Newham as per EAL's plan). And then you get into the dreaded Chingford/Edmonton crossing which is an absurdity |
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Post by greenhert on Jan 12, 2021 14:47:03 GMT
Islington South & The City is rather nice, but it means you can't get 3 seats out of RBKC and Westminster, whereas if you give them the city and tolerate a few scraggly boundaries then they can stand on their own. I suspect Islington South will get De Beauvoir instead. Islington can stand alone this time. The solution I have found is Islington West and Islington East & Finsbury. |
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Post by East Anglian Lefty on Jan 12, 2021 15:24:29 GMT
Islington South & The City is rather nice, but it means you can't get 3 seats out of RBKC and Westminster, whereas if you give them the city and tolerate a few scraggly boundaries then they can stand on their own. I suspect Islington South will get De Beauvoir instead. Islington can stand alone this time. The solution I have found is Islington West and Islington East & Finsbury. Yes, you could move half the electors in the boroughs between constituencies. Or you could just move 6500 electors from a ward which fades seamlessly into the present Islington South. I'm puzzled why you think your solution would be the better one. |
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Post by greenhert on Jan 12, 2021 15:38:23 GMT
Islington can stand alone this time. The solution I have found is Islington West and Islington East & Finsbury. Yes, you could move half the electors in the boroughs between constituencies. Or you could just move 6500 electors from a ward which fades seamlessly into the present Islington South. I'm puzzled why you think your solution would be the better one. They may not take kindly to being paired with Hackney and there is no reason to do so. An Islington East constituency has existed before (although it did not include Finsbury as that was a separate borough at the time) as has an Islington South West constituency (close enough to my proposed Islington West). |
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Post by finsobruce on Jan 12, 2021 15:49:38 GMT
Yes, you could move half the electors in the boroughs between constituencies. Or you could just move 6500 electors from a ward which fades seamlessly into the present Islington South. I'm puzzled why you think your solution would be the better one. They may not take kindly to being paired with Hackney and there is no reason to do so. An Islington East constituency has existed before (although it did not include Finsbury as that was a separate borough at the time) as has an Islington South West constituency (close enough to my proposed Islington West). Islington East didn't disappear until 1974, ten years after Finsbury was subsumed but I don't think that matters. It was, of course, the last Islington constituency to return a Tory MP. I don't think being paired with Hackney would be the end of the world but of course, noises would be made to indicate that it was.  |
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