Should spoilt ballots be included in turnout figures?

[neilm]

So? Make a new convention. Given that a lot of results are presented this way anyway, as I and Andrew_S say above, it seems odd not to follow that format when it's been signed off by an RO/ARO

If I go to the polling place, and spoil a ballot, I have literally turned out to vote. I am part of the turnout figure and that should be reflected.

[uhurasmazda]

I would say that for a lot of people, a spoilt ballot is an expression of democratic opinion (it's certainly an argument that comes up quite often re: compulsory voting).

It can be very useful to count spoilt ballots in turnout figures in some situations, such as the c.25% in Argentina who submitted blank ballots in solidarity with Peron while he was in exile. If, say, Lutfur Rahman arranged for the same thing, it would obviously be of psephological interest to take that into account.

[mick745]

I wonder what they do in other countries?

Trouble is we can't start counting them in turnout as it would skew historical comparisons....?

[East Anglian Lefty]

Given we've never had a significant number of spoiled ballots except in local elections using multiple ballot papers (which don't go back an awfully long way), I find the idea that the change would render all previous figures unusable to be a little bit unlikely.

[lancyiain]

Feb 2, 2018 19:05:44 GMT East Anglian Lefty said:

Given we've never had a significant number of spoiled ballots except in local elections using multiple ballot papers (which don't go back an awfully long way), I find the idea that the change would render all previous figures unusable to be a little bit unlikely.

It's not exactly difficult to do the maths to deduct the spoiled ballots from turnout if they are included anyway, however many there are. It would be very easy to compare that turnout figure to previous ones. Or to work out the percentage of valid votes for a candidate if necessary, come to that.

[Jim]

I'm late to this particular party as I've only just joined the forum, but I think spoilt ballots should be included in the turnout, since a person spoiling a ballot has turned out no matter what they chose to do with their paper.

I also think that a summary of all the messages written on spoilt ballot papers should be published as a matter of course after every election.

[finsobruce]

Feb 23, 2018 15:35:12 GMT Jim said:

I'm late to this particular party as I've only just joined the forum, but I think spoilt ballots should be included in the turnout, since a person spoiling a ballot has turned out no matter what they chose to do with their paper.

I also think that a summary of all the messages written on spoilt ballot papers should be published as a matter of course after every election.

to start you off Jim, I can offer the message from one of the ballot papers when i was re-elected in 1994. the voter had scribbled out my name and written in "Gerry Adams - the Sinn fein candidate".

[Jim]

Thanks!

I'm always very curious what gets written on spoilt ballot papers. Would love anyone else's examples!

[greenchristian]

Feb 23, 2018 21:36:34 GMT Jim said:

Thanks!

I'm always very curious what gets written on spoilt ballot papers. Would love anyone else's examples!

I once saw one where somebody had written out a BNP box, complete with a sticker bearing the party logo. And then there was the one "Vive La Revolution" in the 2015 General - I was tempted to argue it was a valid vote for Russell Brand. And the spate of variations on "We don't want a mayor" in last year's West Midlands Mayoral Election.

Most are, however, sadly boring.

[Crimson King]

coincidentally I noted this footnote in the documant linked to in the common result format thread
"Percentage turnout figures all partly depends which of the three main measures of turnout we would want to use: all votes cast over electorate, all votes included in the count (excluding rejected postal votes) over electorate or all valid votes cast (excluding rejected postal votes AND votes rejected at the count) over electorate. We could suggest all three but this adds to the complexity. It is conventional to use the middle one above when discussing turnout."

[timrollpickering]

I remember someone creating a box to vote "Labour" in the AV referendum.

The SNP in 2015 provoked quite a few responses. There were a few people writing them in, one person who had printed out a close-up of Sturgeon & stuck it on the ballot paper and, at the other end of the scale, someone wrote "Miliband sucks Sturgeon's donkey dick".